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Those leading the Church’s pivot to ‘synodality’ must give Catholics more clarity about their goals, Cardinal George Pell said in a wide-ranging interview with The viewers religion editor Damian Thompson.

“The first is that I think we should ask those running it what they hope to get out of it and how they hope to get there,” Cardinal Pell said on Thompson’s podcast, Holy Smoke.

“In addition to these aberrant opinions that may have been offered in Germany, in many parts of the Church, as well as a certain degree of absurdity, good people offer solid Catholic teaching.

“But I think we need a little more clarity from those leading the process about what they hope to achieve.”

Cardinal Pell pointed out that comparisons with Anglicanism have their limits, because “according to his own thinking, Catholic synodality “is not considered a type of parliament”.

“I think it says quite explicitly that the range of views being discussed will be presented to the Pope, and then the Pope will choose what to do with them. Quite different from Anglicans.

Church unity should not be taken for granted, Cardinal Pell added.

“It is a great blessing, built and maintained over centuries by good people and prudent people. And we have to be very careful not to unknowingly damage it.

“Now the potential for differences; tensions between the national synods, is very real. But perhaps even more between the continental synods.

The interview, conducted by Thompson during his visit to Rome and published on March 21, also touched on the issue of the Vatican relaxation with China, the issue of Vatican financial reform and the recent motu owner Traditiones Custodes, among other subjects.

China: “I don’t think we won anything.”

Regarding China, Cardinal Pell said the fact that the 2018 Holy See-China agreement has not been published presents “a preliminary and very substantial difficulty” for those interested in the future of China. Chinese Church.

“I know senior Vatican officials are very unhappy with the way things are going. The deal is there to try to get some space for Catholics.

“Obviously that’s commendable,” he said, before adding, “I don’t think we’ve won anything – the persecution seems to be continuing.”

“In some places they got worse. Of course, I am thinking above all of those Catholics in the underground church. The main point of difference was their loyalty to Peter’s successor.

“We owe them a lot, we owe them our respect and our gratitude.”

At Traditional Custodians

Thompson, a well-known defender of Catholic traditionalists, tried to lure Cardinal Pell on the subject of Traditional Custodiansthe recent motu owner who established new rules for the celebration of the ancient Roman rite of the Mass.

“I have immense sympathy for traditionalists – those who follow the old rite,” Cardinal Pell said.

“But we could be in a situation where things have improved. I do not want to add fuel to the fire, but the concessions that have been granted to [Fraternal Society of St Peter]now they are definitely a step in the right direction.

“The working presumption should be that what has been given to this fraternity also applies to similar fraternities, such as [the Institute of Christ the King, Sovereign Priest].”

Cardinal Pell said he was “in favor of trying to improve the situation. I wouldn’t say or do anything that might rekindle the bushfire. »

Auditors needed for Vatican finances

On Vatican financial reform, Cardinal Pell said “transparency, especially nowadays, is necessary” but did not think it was necessarily the case that the Vatican should “do everything possible” . [its] cards on the table” as long as things were “done fairly and correctly”.

The cardinal reiterated his preference for external auditors, saying they could “achieve what we are aiming for.”

“Now we don’t necessarily require external auditors to publish everything they find, as long as they are independent and competent, and what they recommend is done,” he said.

Cardinal Pell appointed the “big four” accounting firm PricewaterhouseCoopers (PwC) to audit Vatican finances while he headed the Secretariat for the Economy, but their contract was suddenly terminated in 2016.

However, he has remained tight-lipped about the current Vatican financial lawsuit. Regarding the status of former Vatican auditor Libero Milone and the trial of Cardinal Giovanni Angelo Becciu, Cardinal Pell said “we will leave that to the courts to decide.”

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